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about the back design i prefer Option B


I backed the project for 1 Gold deck in standard tuck, but i wanted 2 of each.... and here is where it got complicated...

1. the campaign itself is a bit hidden on kickstarter as it is listed as gadget and not in the playing cards category

Thedissident001 wrote: For what it’s worth I think it’s a mistake categorising this project under “Gadgets” and not “Playing Cards” on KS - A lot of casual traffic won’t stumble on this unless they manually search for playing cards or diffractors in the search field

Exactly this

2.the add ons
right now there is only the "Simplified ADD-ON Price Table"
This doesn't help any EU/UK backers because the prices for those backers are listed in € and £ but we still have to manage the amount in US Dollar.

yes, there was a detailed table aswell but that was complicated (taxes, shipping, price for deck itself, deck shipped with taxes, .... ).

Example: Someone wants 2 Red, 2 Blue , 2 Black.
The backer hast to choose a reward tier first. Only 1 deck is possible.
Now the backer hast to add the other 5 decks he wants but he can only add 1 , 3 or 6 decks ??
So does he need to add 3 and then 1 and again 1 ?

This gets even more complicated if you want to combine Standard decks with a Gold decks or a Gold Metal.

Look at this campaign, how they handle their add-on:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/10 ... cards-limi" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
i think this a very smart solution.

OR

you can list a lot of different reward to choose from like most campaigns do.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/36 ... rs-edition" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Only 2 decks available in this campaign but it had 12 reward tiers, which in my opinion is the easiest and safest for a backer

Hi Kids!

Soooooo.... what if I knocked out a design that met the Vegas theme along with VXD?

LanceTMiller wrote:Hi Kids!

Soooooo.... what if I knocked out a design that met the Vegas theme along with VXD?

Show us what ya got!

LanceTMiller wrote:Hi Kids!

Soooooo.... what if I knocked out a design that met the Vegas theme along with VXD?

A good looking back design with holographic bling?

You have my attention, sir!

While Option B is marginally better than A, it's still not enough to change my mind and pledge. The tuck boxes are not what holding this campaign back, many of the people who wanted traditional tucks were eager to pledge until they were stopped by the back design. I agree with Bradius, one tuck design is better than 3, especially if they're bland anyways, plus it is logistically simpler and cheaper to deal with only one tuck box.

I agree with your assessment, you're not going to fund at this rate, although it's not because of the reasons you think. Please consider bringing in Lance to re-work your back design. He has several successful playing card designs in his portfolio and is well known in the playing card community.

Sinjin

Who do you think contacted Lance today?

Regards

There is a lot of good feedback being offered here. Don't let any of it discourage you. I like the standard faces. That's fine considering what you're doing in regards to technology. A great back design, though, markets itself. Not only will players and collectors rave about nice production features, but nice art does its own advertising.

Cardians wrote:
Show us what ya got!

rousselle wrote:
A good looking back design with holographic bling?

You have my attention, sir!

TwoPiece wrote:There is a lot of good feedback being offered here. Don't let any of it discourage you. I like the standard faces. That's fine considering what you're doing in regards to technology. A great back design, though, markets itself. Not only will players and collectors rave about nice production features, but nice art does its own advertising.

What's up fam?!

I've been out of the spotlight for a minute, but I assure you I'm never far away from the card world. I wrapped a huge (110 custom illustration) boardgame project this year and am now free to pursue other projects.

This one has been on my radar since V1.

With that in mind, I am currently in discussions with VXD to step in and re-work the back design and some select elements.

As always, I want to make sure the community voice is heard first. I have had some amazing experiences in Vegas but I have not spent near as much time in Vegas as some of you.

So, I'll throw it out to you all who are following this thread. What exemplifies the "Vegas Experience" most in your mind? NO ANSWER WILL BE DISREGARDED. Please share your thoughts and I'll get some new concepts poppin'!

Thanks everyone for making this such an excellent community!

A Lance Miller designed Diffractor deck?

MagikFingerz wrote:A Lance Miller designed Diffractor deck?

+1 Gonna have to start stashing away some cash for this one!

I missed a lot today. So the notification in my email that the project was canceled. I was in for the gold metal tuck, was debating on whether or not to pledge for the regular tucks as add-ons, but I was kind of 'meh' about the back design. Also a long time EDM fan, but not really a vegas club goer, so it didn't offer much for me.

I'm glad to hear that you've taken onboard the advice on the back design--- WAIT holy-- Lance is going to be designing the v2 Diffractor deck??!?! I love my Fox Targets deck!

Honestly, it just came to me, I would like to see some sort of fake VXD poker chip design in the middle. At least that would be better than what's there currently. Everyone that I work with plays the poker tables when they go to the local casinos, and Vegas. Could be an unpopular opinion to others, but that's what just popped up in my mind.

Nothing too simple and nothing too fancy would be awesome. The bottom 2 of this picture is a good example IMO:



Edit: I'm an idiot and this is already the middle circle design, basically...

An abstract design without any tie to Vegas or other place I think would have more mass appeal. Would get me to back anyway.

JuFiN wrote:An abstract design without any tie to Vegas or other place I think would have more mass appeal. Would get me to back anyway.

This. Why does it have to be Vegas? Insisting that this deck is Vegas-themed really limits the artistic range and options for a deck and deck designer. This technology is so awesome and It would be great if talented artists could have the freedom to create any design they choose to take full advantage of this technology.

Why not a design related to light? I mean, that's what diffraction is, and what the technology is all about. I'm not exactly sure how you start designing that, but it's the concept I'd begin with.

I could think of a half-dozen decks that are already designed and published that would look awesome with this technology applied to them.

However, if they are considering going with a Lance Miller design, I do like decks like Fox Targets, Makers, Bicycle Codex (yes, I just mentioned an EPC deck), Misc Goods Co, Sentinels... I don't know what you call the style but they feel like they have a similar approach to the arrangement and style of the courts, like a similar type of line-art and approach to the designs of the backs-- there has to be some formal art term for it. Fox Targets, Makers and Sentinels all are competing for top spot in that list though, but I like decks that are done in that style and I think it would like amazing to have a deck like that done with this diffractor technology.

EDIT: Seekers belongs on that list, too. Possibly more so than Sentinels, because while the Sentinels courts fit that theme, the back doesn't. Seekers didn't immediately register because the courts are colored in, but the line-art is in the same style as the other decks, and so are the backs.

JuFiN wrote:An abstract design without any tie to Vegas or other place I think would have more mass appeal. Would get me to back anyway.

Oscar53955 wrote:

JuFiN wrote:An abstract design without any tie to Vegas or other place I think would have more mass appeal. Would get me to back anyway.

This. Why does it have to be Vegas? Insisting that this deck is Vegas-themed really limits the artistic range and options for a deck and deck designer. This technology is so awesome and It would be great if talented artists could have the freedom to create any design they choose to take full advantage of this technology.

JuFiN wrote:An abstract design without any tie to Vegas or other place I think would have more mass appeal. Would get me to back anyway.

I definitely get where you are coming from and without revealing too much, I can say that the Vegas V2's are just a small piece of a much larger picture.

I believe there will be a few of my projects that can convert into the Diffractor line, but to start with we are working the Vegas angle.

I'm excited and believe that we will be presenting you all with a very excellent concept that both utilizes the technology to its fullest extent as well as maintaining the Vegas vibe the team is really wanting to launch.

The problem with a Vegas theme is the subject matter itself. So much of Vegas is (for lack of a better term) cheesy. It's intentionally over-the-top excess doesn't lend itself to classy or elegant design. Some casino's have put out iconic logos/design specific to them, but we've seen the faux casino deck done to death (think Fontaine's or Fulton's). The deck shouldn't be so literal like the V2 design, no pasting images of concerts, clubs, show girls, slots, lounge acts, etc... If you can pull off an abstract design that evokes luxury, that would be theme appropriate without crossing over kitsch. Good luck.

I just received my prize for the 2017 DoY a Black First Day Issue, and that is a very interesting deck. The tech in there is quite impressive. The deck itself also handles pretty well. Just two things I think need improvement:
- Marks that show through the faces, much like any other foiled deck;
- Cut, the cards almost look like they aren't all of the same size.

Now back on topic: Great news that Lance is joinning the project, I sure the result will be amazing.

Firstly - Great to be working with Lance Miller. We had been in discussions for a fair few months already. Then with the V2 card back art feedback we got, it just kicked the collaboration deal in sooner. When we first started research into playing cards 8+ years ago, when the tech was conceived, Lance Miller cards were one of our biggest inspirations and guides for great base artwork (which I told Lance when I first got to know him). We are more technically minded and engineering side, as opposed to artists. We are very happy to be working with such a great artist now

Secondly - Regarding the Vertex Deck units we sent out as prizes - Happy to hear that Roope and Sergio are impressed and interested, as it appears from their feedback.

sms - Re the cutting. Another lesson learned there.....we designed in a very small white border for the Vertex Deck, which made things very difficult for the factory responsible for the cutting. This was actually one (but not the only) reason that the first print run was entirely rejected. It was then greatly improved the second time round. Such thin borders can really exaggerate the perspective...we won't make that mistake again. It will forever be a quirk / tell-tale of our very first edition.

Regards

sinjin7 wrote:The problem with a Vegas theme is the subject matter itself. So much of Vegas is (for lack of a better term) cheesy. It's intentionally over-the-top excess doesn't lend itself to classy or elegant design. Some casino's have put out iconic logos/design specific to them, but we've seen the faux casino deck done to death (think Fontaine's or Fulton's). The deck shouldn't be so literal like the V2 design, no pasting images of concerts, clubs, show girls, slots, lounge acts, etc... If you can pull off an abstract design that evokes luxury, that would be theme appropriate without crossing over kitsch. Good luck.

You're right, the faux casino decks are not the way to go here, nor is it appropriate to go way over the top. We need to find a delicate balance between an abstract design that evokes the Vegas lifestyle mentality more so than it just being about clubs / parties / casinos, or any singular topic. When people think of Vegas, they think of the glitz and glamour, the shows, the lights, the excitement and energy that comes from escaping reality even if it's only for a little while. It's a challenging project to be sure, but it will be a great exercise in design balance and craftsmanship.

sms69x wrote:I just received my prize for the 2017 DoY a Black First Day Issue, and that is a very interesting deck. The tech in there is quite impressive. The deck itself also handles pretty well. Just two things I think need improvement:
- Marks that show through the faces, much like any other foiled deck;
- Cut, the cards almost look like they aren't all of the same size.

Now back on topic: Great news that Lance is joining the project, I sure the result will be amazing.

Thanks! I appreciate your vote of confidence

And to everyone else voicing their support for my involvement, thank you so much!

It's so great to be working with such a talented and professional artist as Lance on our Vegas Diffractor Project now!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_8RQzFuwVw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hope this wouldn't be a one-way back...

Damn, that sketch looks so nice.

LOVING the new art!

vincero wrote:Hope this wouldn't be a one-way back...

^^^ +1

One-way backs....No way Jose!!

Glad you guys are liking the first sketches here. I'm loving the collab, working with Lance!

Cheers

this sketch is already lookin' super nice! also, I think the personification with the Lady Luck character (or at least that's who I'm hoping is depicted there lol) is a really clever touch - please do keep sharing the design process with us

Luck be a lady.....and what a beautiful lady she shall be. Lance is THE MAN.

Hot damn!

The only critique I have is that there's a bit too much "frame" - the outer frame (the small circles and the outermost line) could IMO be removed and the remaining design could be enlarged. Too many or too "thick" frames doesn't do the "main" artwork any favors, only makes it smaller.

But other than that - hot damn!

I like the ladies head in the first picture more, but that looks dope as smurf.